wildestlogs | In Which Caroline Organizes a Town Hall

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In Which Caroline Organizes a Town Hall

Who: Everyone
What: Caroline holds court and everyone hashes it out over how to organize.
Where: The Heartstone.
When: After the leadership post on the network.
Warnings/Notes: Conversations may get intense due to the baggage characters are bringing to any conversation about authority, particularly structural authority. Threadhopping is encouraged; my notifs are off and you can treat this like a network post, just with face-to-face interaction. The mods reserve the right to shut down threads or the post entirely if it gets out of hand.

Caroline and Stacia have, by now, made little portable deer-hide cushions for every person they've counted up in the camp, all fifty three. It's taken them a while, and in the meantime, Stacia was on the mirror network announcing her candidacy for leadership, and Caroline was in the background making little tutting and tch noises. This is why she doesn't do the internet.

Finally, she gets her own mirror out and makes an announcement, then arranges the little cushions for everyone in a wide, multi-tiered circle, staggered so everyone has a view towards the center, all at perfect fifteen degree angles to the one next to them. She sets six little campfires to ensure everything's well-lit. And she folds her arms and she waits.

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[It doesn't take long for Ange to arrive, although to be honest that's just because this seems like the sort of thing she should be aware of]

Aren't you all overthinking things a little? There's no way we're getting anywhere close to a result that'll make everyone happy. In the end we're all going to do our thing and listen to anyone foolish enough to take the leadership positions when we think it suits us or is convenient for us.

[Which is why she's largely content with letting things happen here without her chiming in much: she's not exactly going to follow orders mindlessly. She will cooperate, of course! And in battle she probably will heed others' advice and orders! But she hardly will see anyone as 'in charge' no matter the situation, really. To her, all this will just serve to stroke egos and make others get angry.

Still...she says all that aloud because she's pretty sure her opinion is shared by others. No way there's people here who think defining a leader will mean there won't be any problems in the future, there are too many people for such a thing]

Edited 2021-12-01 22:26 (UTC)

[Kon hopes they don't need a conch for this...]

Alright, after talking to some people I get a little more where some of you are coming from.

Some of us come from places where formal leadership works because we're just lucky to enough to have real good people stepping up. Some of you come from places where you're unlucky enough that no one that steps up to power is ever decent. Or there was a whole power structure over your heads messing with you. It sounds like you distrust it because of bad experiences, or experiences shaping your beliefs.

That's understandable, and the people that want something really rigid will have to suck it up a little, make some concessions, and accept something looser. Because people can't cooperate if some of them are massively stressed out, like, all the time.

But if we sacrifice the L-word specifically during the crisis bits we probably can't sacrifice voluntary training and voluntary organization. People seem good about the camp organization part, like people have pointed out. But the training we definitely need to talk about. Even verbally telling each other what our powers are isn't going to be enough because this many people, used to not fighting or fighting different ways and different enemies? Are going to trip over each other's feet.

I've been on a team with 30 plus people before. The work we had to put in just to avoid friendly fire was insane. And a lot of them had been opt-in, and at it for years.

We also probably need to consider some pre-agreed on tactics where the group emergency plans ahead of time. Maybe picking people to always handle certain tasks - like, say, if someone has shield powers, they know if they see a wave of arrows or giant fireball, to step up without being asked or told, to shield the whole group from a big attack. Or "if we're pinned down, the first person that sees an exit directs everyone to it over the mirrors." Stuff like that.

Saying we're looking out for each other, and wanting to, doesn't mean people won't freeze up.

If people on one side need to sacrifice some rigidity, people on the other side have to accept at least a little order. From the sound of it I don't think some of you even disagree, but it still needs to be said and agreed on then.

[No one needs a conch because Caroline brought a talking pillow, which she shoves at Kon's hands when he starts talking and then retrieves when he seems like he's done.

She continues to do this at everyone else who pipes up.]

[Ange, meet the talking pillow. Caroline shoves it at Ange when Ange makes her statement, and she figures that Ange's right: who in God's name wants to be a leader in a group that's already shown itself to be hostile to command? She's probably the pushiest, more coordination-happy person she knows, and even she thinks that hot potato is rotten.

She keeps passing the talking pillow around.]

[Elle was one of the first people who showed up. She's put herself in the middle of things, wanting to be in a position to help de-escalate things if necessary.

She decides that she should respond to Kon as a show of good faith. She motions to Caroline for the talking pillow and begins to speak, but doesn't stand. Her shoulders are set in determination, but she curled in on herself, slightly, out of nervousness. She's showcasing vulnerability, but her voice is calm and steady.]

I think having plans for emergency situations is a good idea. People can choose to be on civilian evacuation duty, or during combat healing, and the like. That way if we need something in the moment, we know who we can depend on.

Sparring together is also a good idea. I don't want to have to pick someone up and get them out of the way quickly and accidentally injure them because I underestimated my strength, or overestimated their ability to land safely. If we know each other better, we can trust each other more, and more formal organization will become less necessary as time goes on.

As long as we agree to no leadership positions and no formal power structures, I think we'll be okay. The biggest thing is that we can't afford to alienate each other. If there are conflicts, we settle them between individuals or as a group, but no one gets final judgement or to mete out punishment.

[Elle hesitates before her next words, a bit worried about how they'll come across. Will it seem like trying to control others to those who distrust anyone who takes charge? Will it seem like trying to manipulate situations to those who are used to established institutions? She's not sure, but she feels obligated to say it anyway.]

I've been working as a negotiator and diplomat for a few years, now. For those who aren't familiar, I come from a world where there are a lot of groups who may be somewhat ideologically aligned but they fail to work together without the situation devolving into fighting and bloodshed. I've worked with these different groups in order to find peaceful conclusions to what would otherwise be very violent encounters.

What I'm trying to say is that there's bound to be conflict in a group this size, especially with all of our varying backgrounds. I am offering to help mediate conflicts, or just to talk people through their struggles with others. I am well aware that no one here has a reason to trust me at my word, but I want to make the offer anyway. I genuinely want everyone to not only be safe, but to feel safe.

This is not a petition for a specific role in the community. I just want to help where I can.

[God, she always sounds so formal when she speak in this kind of setting. She hopes people don't think she's unapproachable, or an elitist asshole. Calm and formal is just her default with shit like this.]

Edited 2021-12-01 22:53 (UTC)

[Ange receives the pillow, staring at it with surprise. Oh! Well, someone sure took the position of moderator here! She stares at it with some amusement while she talks and once it's taken away from her, she comments:]

Meetings are a nightmare.

[And even more if you're the one trying to keep it under control. Godspeed to you, Caroline]

Training was what I was plannin' on doing anyway.

[ This is the closest Guts gets to an open invitation. Was there a pillow? He's just jumping in. ]

Must've been a lifetime ago since I've done joint drills. Can't really avoid 'em with a group this big, though.

Edited 2021-12-01 23:18 (UTC)

[ At some point, Tommy has gotten ahold of the talking pillow. God help you all, right? Wrong. ]

Yo, Caroline! How long do I gotta talk to keep the pillow? I don’t have one.

[Saturday raises her hand when she wants the talking pillow. She's done this before. She's also a lot calmer, having gotten her swears out in private.]

In essence, I agree with you, an' with Elle. We gotta get organized, and we gotta learn to fight together, and we gotta have contingency plans that everyone knows an' can act on the next time the nightmare lobsters or god knows what else show up.

That bein' said, Elle is also completely right that it can't be formal and it can't have teeth. No police, no group punishments, no body of individuals elected or otherwise who get to decide where the line is and slap down anyone who doesn't toe it. That's not going to work. There's too many of us and we're all too different. Like even now - and please don't take this bad, I'm not comin' for ya, I'm givin' an example - you're still kinda phrasing it like you're doin' us a favor. Sayin' that we feel the way we do because we have bad experiences, so you're going to kindly not use 'the l-word' in front of us, so we're not stressed out. 'Cause we were just unlucky enough to be born into worlds that aren't like yours.

I've been to five different worlds so far, an' I've talked to people from a lot more. Worlds where all the leadership is good, decent, an' kind an' givin' 'em power always works out are the exception, not the rule.

The heart a' the conflict to me seems to be that sort of - rushin' in with our own assumptions an' not stoppin' to hear the other side, talkin' past each other on things that hurt. I don't think anyone here is a bad person, or a bad actor, or isn't basically in agreement about how to treat each other movin' forward. But right now I'm strugglin' t'figure how I can talk to you about how, well scared the entire conversation made me feel, 'cause I can't shake the feelin' you're not gonna take that fear seriously.

[she coughs, embarrassed by a display of emotion that isn't humour, hunger, or rage]

On a more practical note, if people're just havin' trouble figuring out how that kinda horizontal organization works, I can help there. We did this sorta thing back home.

You can have the pillow at the end of the town hall if you mind your manners and tell me how good my hair looks in this braid.

[See? Caroline can tease.]

[Raistlin arrives and seats himself, declining any offer of a talking pillow with a shake of his head. He's only here to observe]

Sweet deal.

[ Tommy gives the group a sort of here’s the deal, palms to the ground gesture. ]

If I wanted to live under a Council, I’d be on Krakoa. Which I’m not, cause I’m here, but I’m not at home either. I don’t care what we do as long as I get to punch someone in the face for kidnapping me before I go home. Caroline says no cursing, so I guess that’s it for me.

[ Oh hol’ up. ]

If anybody named Iron Man turns up, I want like him and sixteen other dudes banned from giving me orders. Caroline looks like a mermaid who’s worshipped by an entire cult. Who’s up next?

Edited 2021-12-01 23:48 (UTC)

The reason I'm acting like it's a favor is because you're not the only one terrified.

One of my first big outings as a superhero was into a city that got leveled. Millions gone in a heartbeat. Bodies and wreckage everywhere. I've looked at worlds crashing in the sky and had to get my body shredded and die to stop it. I've fought in a war in space and wound up a POW on a nightmare planet. I've watched time fall apart.

The thing all those things had in common was bad things were either so huge they were out of our control - which is a tough thing to carry existentially and you want to fight it with control, or they were that big and bad because of no clear leadership, or they got that bad because someone fought good leadership, or leadership was the only thing that got us through it okay.

The way the convo was originally going with people being smartasses about "how could you think that was a good idea ever, dumb idea award ding ding ding" [He eyeballs her because she knows who that was] made it sound like they think their experiences trumped all.

Even right now, if you agree with all I'm saying from the get go, no concessions needed on your side? You're getting every single thing you want and are okay with in the deal, while I'm conceding something huge. A thing that makes me feel secure. Not exactly an even deal, is it?

So if you don't want it to sound like a favor and big concession for the sake of teamwork, don't make me choke down all my fear without being willing to touch your own.

I'll do what's good for the group but I'm allowed to be a little bitter about it. And I'm allowed to feel it's uneven and slightly unfair. I'm allowed to feel like I'm doing you a favor by ignoring my fear and preferences.

[Elle narrows her eyes at Tommy. She gets the urge to make jokes and break the tension, but this meeting really matter to some people and derailing feels kind of rude and immature.

So there's only one thing to do, which is to be rude and immature right back.]

You can keep the pillow, Tommy, don't worry.

[Elle smiles sweetly. She winks at Caroline, then stands up and walks over to where Tommy's sitting. With an ease that doesn't seem possible for a girl her age and build, she lifts Tommy up off the ground, pillow and all, and looks for the person who talks next.

Ah, excellent. Guts could definitely bench press Tommy.]

[Caroline takes the pillow back, giving Tommy a flirty little smile before facing the group.]

Back where I'm from, we had a secret council run by the descendants of the people who founded Mystic Falls. [Caroline has a note of pride in her voice when she talks about those founders; it's very clear she's one of the descendants of the founders, and thinks that that entitles her to something.

But. Her voice hardens and her expression gets firm.]

They were a secret society trying to murder all vampires, under the guise of keeping the town safe. And they all ended up dead, basically. Almost all of them.

I think it's safe to say that if anyone's organizing anything - including teams going off on their own - they need to be transparent with everyone here. No secret societies, no cliques united around disliking other people in the group. We're already super divided by the fact that we all come from different backgrounds and half of us are different species.

You were talking, so you needed the pillow. [She explains as if this is all fine and normal, why are you staring at me like that?

She goes back to her previous spot and primly sits down.]

[ O.o ]

You’re too old for me.

[Kerrigan doesn't want a pillow, to sit on or to hold, and she crouches beside Raistlin rather than sit.]

What's all this about?

[Guess who still refuses to deal with a magical mirror and thus missed the whole explosion?]

[Saturday eyeballs him right back]

I didn't say I wasn't doin' the same thing. I used we the whole damn time. An' if you wanna whip out our trauma an' play who's got it worse, I can play that game too. This is an olive branch. I'm tryin' not to read what you're sayin' as you throwin' it in my face.

You feel it's unfair an' uneven. So do I. You feel like you're doin' me a favor. I don't feel like I'm doin' you one. I feel like I'm fightin' for my safety, an' the safety of some people who really fuckin' matter to me.

I'm sorry I snapped at your friend. I dunno where he is; once I find him I'll say it to his face. I can apologize when I fuck up. Like I said, I was scared, I came in hot, an' it was shitty. But I also came in after I'd seen how you an' your friend were reacting t'other people objectin' in mild terms. I saw two people convinced they knew everything doin' their best to steamroller anyone who didn't agree. An' you just said yourself it was a fear response. So what conclusion am I supposed to draw? Your fear matters more than mine?

[ Well Tommy, you're in his big, beefy arms now. What is even happening.

He's not saying anything, he's just looking at Elle with a deadpan stare and the most awkward silence in the universe.

He will then promptly drop him. ]

[She addresses this to everyone, not just Kon and Saturday.]

No one was prepared for that to turn into a serious debate about organizing ourselves. I don't think it's fair to hold people's instinctual reactions against each other. Everyone was speaking from a place of fear and uncertainty, and we lashed out. This is our chance to have a more careful and deliberate conversation.

[Come on, guys, don't make this personal.]

So like. I'm used to structure. I like structure. Stucture has kept me alive for years and it's just, you know, like, good for me as a person, I guess. That's something I understand about myself. And I'm lucky--I got structure here. Stacia and Ace are both higher up in the werewolf world than me, so in a crisis, I go looking for them to get instructions.

[ She clears her throat, frowns. ]

And that's like, regardless of how the rest of this shakes out. No offense, but I don't take fuckin' marching orders from anyone but them, and they don't even like giving orders unless they have to.

[ Mackenzie waves a hand, then settles her hands on her hips. ]

But, like. I don't expect everyone else to listen to Stacia. I mean, they should, because she's smart and knows what the fuck she's doing but I understand if people don't. So I'm like... we can't make people have structure that they don't want. If a bunch of y'all superheroes or whatever want to organize a team to kill shit, that's your business. I'm not saying not to do that, especially if makes you feel better.

What I'm saying is you can't expect anyone to actually listen if they don't want to listen. Like, Saturday and Kon over there about concessions and shit. Framing people not wanting to do what you say as 'making concessions' just sounds weird to me.

It's like if I were to say that because I've seen my whole pack get fucking gunned down by vampires and seen what happens when the Wyrm is winning, that means I get to make some kind of demand that people listen to Stacia. Or like people NOT listening to Stacia is me making concessions, which is just... we're starting from no one listening to jack and shit. I dunno. I'm not smart. I just kill shit. I'm a soldier. A warrior. A weapon. Wind me up and point me at the bad guys.

[ Mackenzie mimes pointing a gun with her thumb and forefinger. Bang. ]

Having like, votes and shit to put specific people in charge or makin' ourselves into a little unit... I can see the usefulness there, but I don't want to be doing that alongside people who aren't interested in doing it.

Edited 2021-12-02 00:10 (UTC)

Ah. Someone with a way with words and good reasoning. That's kind of a breath of fresh air.

[More like someone who was more interested than Ange in putting into the right words the general opinion she also has, and has more charisma than Ange does. Still, Ange fully agrees, although of course, she can't say she has even a iota of the fighting skill Mackenzie does]

[he nods, recognizing Kerrigan]

Who's going to lead us. Two factions have developed, each convinced of their own righteousness. It should be quite the show.

[Saturday gives Mackenzie a nod

Well said.

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In Which Caroline Organizes a Town Hall

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thread chaos is the true winner here.

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